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Starter Precision Rifle?





Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
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#1
I have decided to start to get into long range precision shooting. I know that this will be a journey and will take time and practice. Right now I'm shooting a Ruger M77 .270 and know that this a 200-300 yard gun because it was built to hunt. It is probably a 2 or 3moa gun. The barrel, stock and trigger will never get me where I want to go but will give me good 200 yrd practice to start developing my habits and skills.

So I've been doing alot of research and have narrowed things down a little. I have a few choices but they are definitely going in different directions. Choice #1: bolt action Savage model 10 FCP-K http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/ (need to click center fire, Law Enforcement, 10 FCP=K). It will run $800ish and still need bipod $100ish, scope mounts$150ish. I have a decent scope. Total $1050.
Choice #2 Semi Auto DPMS LR 308 or 30LRT-SASS http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=4851 or http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=1999
LR 308 $1300ish with chrome bolt and action. Same bipod and scope mounts. Total $1500 or SASS $2100 complete.

All three of these choices should be sub MOA although the bolt gun should stay that way to maybe 1200yrds, SA guns maybe 1000yrds although the .308 may only be able to do the job out to 800-1000yrds. SA guns are more versatile to also use in CQB role. Also the SASS is 7.62 vs .308.

So what are the pros and cons as you see them on these 3 weapons? I really don't want to talk about every other weapon in the world so let's stick to these. I'm staying with this caliber for my new weapon for the practical reason of availability of good match ammo and reloading mixes. Also is my budget for scope mounts doable? I'm thinking a Pic rail and rings. What is a good setup to use?
 
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nevadadave

Guest
#2
I don't know if I will be any real help to you but I bought the Savage 10 Carbine and other than the stock being exceptionally light in the ass end, it is a really nice shooter. I bought it with the intention to swap to the new Choate tactical stock and install the Savage DBM kit from Tactical Works Inc.

Here is apparently the only photo of the rifle in its current config. pardon the hillbilly shoot-out scene.


My friend is shooting a Savage 10 like you are looking for but about 5 years older. We had just finished repainting his rifle this summer. I bought mine because his has served so absolutely well over the years.
 

Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
Staff member
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2019 Supporter
#3
The FCP-K comes with the Accu-stock also. I don't know if that will affect the balance at all. Thanks for the input.
 

nevadadave

Guest
#4
I would imagine your savage would be worse off than mine is since mine is sporting a 20" barrel. With the bull barrel that tupperware stock makes it really front heavy. That being said it I had it to do over again I would still buy the savage because if I am precision shooting (er trying to do so) I like the bolt gun over the AR platform. Just personal preference though.
Good Luck.
 

Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
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#5
These 2 DPMS guns are built to be precision shooters and are Sub-MOA guns. After the bipod goes on the Savage will be even more nose heavy. The scope will help balance it out a little but not enough. More than likely the Savage will spend most ot it's time on a bipod or rest though.
 

JimBianchi

Daddy
Forum Supporter
#6
If I was dead set on a "sniper" rifle on a budget I'd get the Savage (and a great scope) and shoot the barrel off of it. 100rds a week for 2 or 3 years and you'll be ready for a new barrel or a better gun/round. (Reloading will pay itself quickly!)

(Keep it at 800yds or less, until you can group 6inches all day with 10rounds at 800yrds, no need to move up to 1200yrds. You'll want a magnum anyways for those shots.)

If I wanted a multi-purpose rifle that could also put one on the kill zone at 800yrds, I'd consider the semi-auto, but only if I was sure the gun could do its part.
 

JFComfort

Long Range Shooter
#7
I have decided to start to get into long range precision shooting. I know that this will be a journey and will take time and practice. Right now I'm shooting a Ruger M77 .270 and know that this a 200-300 yard gun because it was built to hunt. It is probably a 2 or 3moa gun. The barrel, stock and trigger will never get me where I want to go but will give me good 200 yrd practice to start developing my habits and skills.

So I've been doing alot of research and have narrowed things down a little. I have a few choices but they are definitely going in different directions. Choice #1: bolt action Savage model 10 FCP-K http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/ (need to click center fire, Law Enforcement, 10 FCP=K). It will run $800ish and still need bipod $100ish, scope mounts$150ish. I have a decent scope. Total $1050.
Choice #2 Semi Auto DPMS LR 308 or 30LRT-SASS http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=4851 or http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=1999
LR 308 $1300ish with chrome bolt and action. Same bipod and scope mounts. Total $1500 or SASS $2100 complete.

All three of these choices should be sub MOA although the bolt gun should stay that way to maybe 1200yrds, SA guns maybe 1000yrds although the .308 may only be able to do the job out to 800-1000yrds. SA guns are more versatile to also use in CQB role. Also the SASS is 7.62 vs .308.

So what are the pros and cons as you see them on these 3 weapons? I really don't want to talk about every other weapon in the world so let's stick to these. I'm staying with this caliber for my new weapon for the practical reason of availability of good match ammo and reloading mixes. Also is my budget for scope mounts doable? I'm thinking a Pic rail and rings. What is a good setup to use?
Quickdraw, you should come out some time and shoot rifles with us. We have everything from sub-moa DPMS gas guns, stock Remington 700 barrelled actions to full blown custom guns in trick calibers. Oh and Dane's .50 BMG!

If you were looking to get into this you have a lot of choices and different directions you can go.

The Savage is a solid gun and has a big after market so you can upgrade different components as you progress. At our alt you will have no problem (depending on your bullet choice) driving a .308 to 1000 meters.

The gas gun is also a good choice but when it comes to pure precision and accuracy no gas gun today will hang with a accurized bolt gun. What I mean is that it depends on the level of accuracy you want and what your preference is as far as a weapons platform.

Dane has a DPMS LR-308 that is a sub-moa shooter with 168 A-Max's and Varget. From what I heard though it isn't very often your get a sub-moa gas guy. They are typically 1 moa..

Personally I would guide you to get a Remington 700 Short Action because it has the biggest aftermarket and every smith can work on one for you and you can do a lot of it yourself. Something like aRemington 700P/PSS, LTR, SPS-Tactical or SPS Varmint. As you progress and you feel the want for more accuracy and consistancy you can always have Bentwood Gunsmithing blue print and true the action and bolt. With a top of the line barrel you can easily have a .25 moa gun but it get very expensive fast.

Get solid glass, scopes like a super sniper, 3200 elite, millit or other solid optic with .25 moa elevation and windage. A mil dot retical is nice but if you can find one with half mil has marks that's better.

That would be a solid start into the long range/precision shooting. Your best off shooting match ammo or better yet rolling your own.

Its do-able. Let me warn you now, this type of shooting is very addictive and expensive. I've been bit, I've been bit very bad...


 
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JFComfort

Long Range Shooter
#8
Talk to Guido, he got a killer deal for Pachinko Pistola. It was a Remington 700 SPS Tactical with a 20 moa base full length picitanny rail $500 bucks.
 

Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
Staff member
Moderator
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2019 Supporter
#9
I was going to see Guido tomorrow anyway.

I was there today but he wasn't in yet. I am somewhat prepared for the time and expense of getting into precision shooting. I also understand that this is a process so my starting point is a good quality starter weapon. My gut tells me that going bolt is probably the smart way to go. I bought and mounted a Bushnell Elite 3200 Tactical scope last month and plan on moving it to the new rifle. I'm also planning on getting into a loading machine so I can get a round and load that works. I appreciate the invite to get out with you guys and plan on taking you up on it when I'm a little more prepared with time and hardware.
 

Jim Fuller

Rifle Dynamics 07FFL/SOT
#10
Quickdraw, you should come out some time and shoot rifles with us. We have everything from sub-moa DPMS gas guns, stock Remington 700 barrelled actions to full blown custom guns in trick calibers. Oh and Dane's .50 BMG!

If you were looking to get into this you have a lot of choices and different directions you can go.

The Savage is a solid gun and has a big after market so you can upgrade different components as you progress. At our alt you will have no problem (depending on your bullet choice) driving a .308 to 1000 meters.

The gas gun is also a good choice but when it comes to pure precision and accuracy no gas gun today will hang with a accurized bolt gun. What I mean is that it depends on the level of accuracy you want and what your preference is as far as a weapons platform.

Dane has a DPMS LR-308 that is a sub-moa shooter with 168 A-Max's and Varget. From what I heard though it isn't very often your get a sub-moa gas guy. They are typically 1 moa..

Personally I would guide you to get a Remington 700 Short Action because it has the biggest aftermarket and every smith can work on one for you and you can do a lot of it yourself. Something like aRemington 700P/PSS, LTR, SPS-Tactical or SPS Varmint. As you progress and you feel the want for more accuracy and consistancy you can always have Bentwood Gunsmithing blue print and true the action and bolt. With a top of the line barrel you can easily have a .25 moa gun but it get very expensive fast.

Get solid glass, scopes like a super sniper, 3200 elite, millit or other solid optic with .25 moa elevation and windage. A mil dot retical is nice but if you can find one with half mil has marks that's better.

That would be a solid start into the long range/precision shooting. Your best off shooting match ammo or better yet rolling your own.

Its do-able. Let me warn you now, this type of shooting is very addictive and expensive. I've been bit, I've been bit very bad...


This is good solid advice, JFComfert has forgotten more about long range shooting than most will ever know.
 

Sonic Sammy

Obsessed Member
#11
I have decided to start to get into long range precision shooting. I know that this will be a journey and will take time and practice. Right now I'm shooting a Ruger M77 .270 and know that this a 200-300 yard gun because it was built to hunt. It is probably a 2 or 3moa gun. The barrel, stock and trigger will never get me where I want to go but will give me good 200 yrd practice to start developing my habits and skills.

So I've been doing alot of research and have narrowed things down a little. I have a few choices but they are definitely going in different directions. Choice #1: bolt action Savage model 10 FCP-K http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/ (need to click center fire, Law Enforcement, 10 FCP=K). It will run $800ish and still need bipod $100ish, scope mounts$150ish. I have a decent scope. Total $1050.
Choice #2 Semi Auto DPMS LR 308 or 30LRT-SASS http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=4851 or http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=1999
LR 308 $1300ish with chrome bolt and action. Same bipod and scope mounts. Total $1500 or SASS $2100 complete.

All three of these choices should be sub MOA although the bolt gun should stay that way to maybe 1200yrds, SA guns maybe 1000yrds although the .308 may only be able to do the job out to 800-1000yrds. SA guns are more versatile to also use in CQB role. Also the SASS is 7.62 vs .308.

So what are the pros and cons as you see them on these 3 weapons? I really don't want to talk about every other weapon in the world so let's stick to these. I'm staying with this caliber for my new weapon for the practical reason of availability of good match ammo and reloading mixes. Also is my budget for scope mounts doable? I'm thinking a Pic rail and rings. What is a good setup to use?
Have you looked in the for sale page on this site?
I have a Remington 700 in 300 Winchester Mag for sale.
 
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Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
Staff member
Moderator
Forum Supporter
2019 Supporter
#14
Once again New Frontier Armory is "The Place"

After spending some time with Guido this morning I've pretty much decided on a Remington 700 LRT in .308. I will start with the basic model and build it as I learn and grow in the sport. Since New Frontier Armory opened just a few months ago they have become my first and almost only store to buy from. One more time today these guys have gone above and beyond to do what was right for me instead of only thinking about making a quick sale. They continue to "earn" my business by treating me the way that I treat my customers in my business. What more could anyone ask for.
 

Mr Pheer

Obsessed Member
#15
My starter is my Savage 10 BAS. Hoping to meet up with someone that can show me a few things, I'm new to the long range stuff. Well, long range with a rifle I mean. Did long range with a howitzer for years.
 

JFComfort

Long Range Shooter
#16
My starter is my Savage 10 BAS. Hoping to meet up with someone that can show me a few things, I'm new to the long range stuff. Well, long range with a rifle I mean. Did long range with a howitzer for years.
Look under "the range" and post up in the long range thread. We shoot tactical precision matches and long range for fun, were always trying to get others to join us. How can you miss it?
 

Mr Pheer

Obsessed Member
#17
Look under "the range" and post up in the long range thread. We shoot tactical precision matches and long range for fun, were always trying to get others to join us. How can you miss it?
I didnt miss it. Just waiting on my pelican case to arrive from Midway so I dont scratch up my pretty rifle when I leave the house with it :001_cool:
 

JFComfort

Long Range Shooter
#18
I didnt miss it. Just waiting on my pelican case to arrive from Midway so I dont scratch up my pretty rifle when I leave the house with it :001_cool:

Cool! hit us up when you get that case for your rifle, we'll have a blast.

I saw your post about your rifle and glass. Sounds like a sweet set up, hopefully you can get together with me and the guys soon.
 
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robstar

Obsessed Member
#19
Rather than start a new thread along the same topic I'll post here.

I've been considering something along the lines of a 700 as a longer range weapon; not for match, just hunting and our bug out location to supplement my ARs

The 700 LRT and variants like the TWS look like a good compact solution. The practical side of me says go with something in .223 since I have ample supplies of that and it is compatible with my existing rifles. The other side of me says I should have a more robust caliber such as .308 that is still common to find and trade if needed but packs more punch at distance. I'm not particularly found of long barreled front heavy guns, plus I'm not looking to reach out 600-800+ yards.

Any comments, suggestion and questions would be appreciated.

Thanks!

RobStar
 

Quickdraw

"Ho'old on there"
Staff member
Moderator
Forum Supporter
2019 Supporter
#20
Rather than start a new thread along the same topic I'll post here.

I've been considering something along the lines of a 700 as a longer range weapon; not for match, just hunting and our bug out location to supplement my ARs

The 700 LRT and variants like the TWS look like a good compact solution. The practical side of me says go with something in .223 since I have ample supplies of that and it is compatible with my existing rifles. The other side of me says I should have a more robust caliber such as .308 that is still common to find and trade if needed but packs more punch at distance. I'm not particularly found of long barreled front heavy guns, plus I'm not looking to reach out 600-800+ yards.

Any comments, suggestion and questions would be appreciated.

Thanks!

RobStar
I'm going through the exact same process right now. There are some great people on here with a lot of experience to help. Another great resource to you is to get ahold of Guido at New Frontier Armory. He not only can get you the best price on you weapon once you've decided but has hands on practical experience about these types of rifles as part of his current job in the military.

I decided on going 308 for very practical reasons. This is perhaps the most researched and used round in the history of long range precision shooting. It is very stout and will have a multitude of ammo and reloading options because it is so widely used. I am also very well setup with .223/5.56 but wanted a more robust option in this type of a weapon. Even if I never need to use it at over 500 yards the potential is there and will even be more accurate at those shorter distances.

While you can get the 700 LTR in .223 the TWS only comes in .308. These rifles will be great right out of the box but have great potential to be made even better. I plan on ordering mine in a week or so after the SHOT Show and will probably leave it stock until my skills grow enough to deserve anything more. I'm pumped, especially to get out with some of the long rang guys on here and to start learning.